Mormonism has a complicated relationship with paying church leaders. We have scriptures that condemn priestcrafts and the Church has often bragged about not having a paid clergy. Yet the church also defends paying Church leaders a “living stipend”. This episode searches out what the scriptures have to say, a reveals that the D&C commands that some leaders be paid while others must not be paid…the only problem is today’s Church does the exact opposite!
2 Nephi 26:29-31
D&C 105:5
Numbers 18:
Luke 9:1-6
Matthew 10:5-11
Acts 3:1-9
Luke 10:1-9
1 Timothy 6:8
Acts 18:1-4
1 Corinthians 9:1-18
Mosiah 18:24-28
Mosiah 27:5
Alma 1:26
Alma 30:32-34
Alma 31:35-38
Alma 8:19-21
3 Nephi 13:25-34
D&C 24:18
D&C 84:77-91
D&C 70:12-14
D&C 107:68
Lectures on Faith 6:7
HC 2:300
D&C 42:71-73
I’ll take your Jesus he knows me and raise you by Another Day in Paradise 🙂 I actually had never seen that music video before, which makes the song even better. This topic is actually one of the reasons I ultimately left the church, because I had been lied to my whole life. I even remember one of the first phrases they taught us in the MTC was “we have no paid clergy”. On my mission I saw a glimpse of the blessings associated with true consecration and with true missionary work. For example, I believe that the actual elders and sisters of the mission field do experience blessings because they are living a semi-consecration by paying their own way for their missions and having that money equalized among all missionaries in the world. Furthermore, I believe God sees their sacrifice, and although the system isn’t fully according to His will he rewards them for their faith. I for one found it immensely satisfying to only have a bag of books and clothing as opposed to all the other cares of life I had had previously so I can only imagine how freeing it will be to give up all worldly possessions and go out only relying on the Lord. Also in the case of food, for example, I can truly say that every time I was hungry as a missionary someone offered us food and drink, it really was amazing, and I hope to be able to go out with the true apostles when they return.
Also, going back to tithing, in the small branches where I served they actually used the tithing and fast offerings to help the people and it was a beautiful thing to see. However, I believe the church has recently changed this policy and all money flows to Salt Lake, and some of it is returned with the rest being used for shopping malls? Private jets? New suits? I guess.
Finally I had a thought when you mentioned the fact that bishops are to be paid for their service. It’s interesting that in the beginning of the podcast you mentioned that the Levites also were to be paid by the people for their temple service, and the D&C states in sections 68:14-20, and 107:15-17 & 71-76 that a bishop is to be a high priest when a literal descendant of Aaron cannot be found, and that literal first born descendants of Aaron have a right by lineage to officiate in the office of bishop. In fact they can even officiate without counselors if they are of the lineage of Aaron. So this once again shows that we actually are under a portion of the Law of Moses that we don’t follow as we should. I’ve actually often wondered if most bishops in the church today are of Aaronic descent? It’s an interesting question to think about at least.
Anyways, I’ll stop rambling now. I look forward to the day when the servants return and manifest the true power of the Gospel of Christ, and perform miracles in His name, because they live by faith and have sacrificed all worldly things as Christ did.
I love both the song suggestions. I will take both the suggested songs and add my own; Would Jesus Wear a Rolex by Ray Stevens.
1. Jesus, He Knows Me by Genesis
2. Another Day in Paradise by Phil Collins
3. Would Jesus Wear a Rolex by Ray Stevens
Another great and thought provoking podcast. Thanks guys.
Thanks for the podcast! It always fun to listen to and see that you have all come to same conclusions I have and even used the same scriptures 🙂
I was surprised though that you didn’t bring up the doctrine of Nehor. When I address this topic with people I love to bring up Nehor’s doctrine from Alma 1, which helps define and give the details of priestcraft. Most can quote 2 Nephi 26:29, but as you mentioned they just use that term to blankly label all kinds of acts, without fully recognizing it. Actually many conflate priestcraft with witchcraft. I think most modern Mormons would buy into Nehor’s doctrine and agree with it, just as they would probably burn Abinadi for saying “that Christ was the God, the Father of all things…and that God should come down…and take up on him flesh.” Mosiah 7:27
Alma 1
3 And he (Nehor) had gone about among the people, preaching to them that which he termed to be the word of God, bearing down against the church; declaring unto the people that every priest and teacher ought to become popular; and they ought not to labor with their hands, but that they ought to be supported by the people.
4 And he also testified unto the people that all mankind should be saved at the last day, and that they need not fear nor tremble, but that they might lift up their heads and rejoice; for the Lord had created all men, and had also redeemed all men; and, in the end, all men should have eternal life.
So, Nehor’s doctrine includes:
1. Every priest and teacher should become popular, should not labor for themselves, but be supported by the people.
2. All mankind will be saved at the last day and have eternal life.
It is interesting to point out that one of the definition for “popular” from the 1828 Websters is:
“Beloved by the people; enjoying the favor of the people; pleasing to people in general; as a popular governor; a popular preacher; a popular ministry; a popular discourse; a popular administration; a popular war or peace. Suspect the man who endeavors to make that popular which is wrong.”
Mormonism sure loves their popular/ “beloved prophet”, who doesn’t labor for himself, but is supported by the people and loves to preach what he terms to be the “word of God”.
Anyways for those who are looking at this topic read through Alma 1 and do some word searches 🙂
/begin_sarcasm
1. The LDS Church does not think all priests and teachers should be supported by the people. Only the special ones are supported.
2. The LDS Church does not teach that all mankind will be saved. Only those that stay on the Old Ship Zion will be saved.
As you can plainly see, your comparison is fundamentally flawed.
/end_sarcasm
Seriously, though, thanks for adding the insight about Nehor’s teachings.
I got banned from the Boise Believers web site because I did not conform to the teaching of Snuffer. I know that he is not paid clergy since he probably made lots of money as an attorney. Why would the Savior choose a lawyer to lead his people? I do not think so. I guess Moses was a prince in Egypt at one time but he was called as a shepherd. I don’t see Snuffer herding goats.
He claims have had one on one conversations with the Savior. Don’t we all have that? Yet, Snuffer claims to be the David spoken of in Isaiah to wit: “Heavenly Father it is I whom you named David…” (T&C 156:1). Wow! So the Boise Believers banned me from their site for finding fault with some of Snuffers doctrine the ending of which was a verse in the 1835 D&C 101:4 to wit: “… Inasmuch as this church of Christ has been reproached with the crime of fornication, and polygamy: we declare that we believe, that one man should have one wife; and one woman, but one husband, except in case of death, when either is at liberty to marry again….” (page 251-152) https://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/doctrine-and-covenants-1835/259
Supposedly this verse shows that Joseph was not a polygamist to which I disagreed and was banned. Go figure.
The Snufferites do not want me disrupting their harmony. To read that verse correctly the following should be inserted after the word “reproached” : (by our adversaries). That is, the adversaries reproached Joseph and the church with the crime of fornication for the unmarried, and the crime of polygamy for the married. Consequently, Joseph states to his adversaries that “one man should have one wife ….” I guess this language in the verse was meant to stifle the attack that was upon the church. Yet, Joseph did not say that he and the church were against polygamy. The Snufferites did not like my argument.
Sorry about being off topic. In Snuffer’s defense, I do like some of his work but he is not David.